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Old 31-05-2012, 08:39 AM   #1
mike s
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Default Lone Star clockwork Stingray question

hi everyone

can anyone tell me whether the clockwork Stingray model should have a 3rd wheel at the back or is it just that tab that sticks down..?

if there is a wheel a pic would be really really appreciated so I can look at knocking one up

cheers
Mike
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Old 31-05-2012, 03:21 PM   #2
TerraForm1
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Hey Mike:
I think its just a tab that trails on the ground. Here's the only pic showing the underside I have (nabbed from an old Evilbay auction).
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File Type: jpg 139474392_o.jpg (83.3 KB, 28 views)
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Old 31-05-2012, 03:33 PM   #3
mike s
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hey thanks you're a legend

any idea what it sold for..? I just got one and it works, I love it

I wonder what the little hole is at the back, it looks like maybe something plugged in there..?


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Hey Mike:
I think its just a tab that trails on the ground. Here's the only pic showing the underside I have (nabbed from an old Evilbay auction).
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Old 31-05-2012, 03:56 PM   #4
TerraForm1
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Mike:
Sorry, can't remember what it sold for - the pic is dated 2008 in my folder.
Regarding the hole:
I'm pretty sure that Lone Star shared the same basic molds for both its clockwork and rubber band powered versions of Stingray. On the rubber band version, you can see in the pics where the tab holding the propeller would slot into the hole located in the tail fin section.
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File Type: jpg 23d1_1.JPG (9.1 KB, 24 views)
File Type: jpg stingray3.jpg (8.9 KB, 24 views)
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Old 31-05-2012, 04:00 PM   #5
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wow this is fab thanks very much

I think you're right - I think the toy is made up from 3 parts, and the part with the eddy damper would have been exactly the same for both toys

same with Lakeside and Lincoln Stingray - same moulds so the Lakeside has a hole for the power cable even though it doesn't have electrics



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Originally Posted by TerraForm1 View Post
Mike:
Sorry, can't remember what it sold for - the pic is dated 2008 in my folder.
Regarding the hole:
I'm pretty sure that Lone Star shared the same basic molds for both its clockwork and rubber band powered versions of Stingray. On the rubber band version, you can see in the pics where the tab holding the propeller would slot into the hole located in the tail fin section.
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Old 31-05-2012, 04:12 PM   #6
TerraForm1
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mike s View Post
wow this is fab thanks very much

I think you're right - I think the toy is made up from 3 parts, and the part with the eddy damper would have been exactly the same for both toys
Yes, I'd agree with your observations. Both toys would share the same upper hull mold. Lone Star and Lakeside had the same cost-saving ideas. The rubber band version was the very first Anderson related toy I had as a child.

http://www.eagletransporter.com/foru...3&d=1320944615

Last edited by TerraForm1; 31-05-2012 at 04:14 PM. Reason: Wrong image
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Old 31-05-2012, 07:01 PM   #7
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right - except the upper nose part is also different as it has the hole for the key, so the bottom and front are unique, and the tail was the same for both

even so I assume tens of thousands in todays money would be saved just by repeating that part..?

I wonder how the heck it was stuck together - some kind of high pressure high-heat kind of process..?


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Originally Posted by TerraForm1 View Post
Yes, I'd agree with your observations. Both toys would share the same upper hull mold. Lone Star and Lakeside had the same cost-saving ideas. The rubber band version was the very first Anderson related toy I had as a child.

http://www.eagletransporter.com/foru...3&d=1320944615
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Old 31-05-2012, 07:13 PM   #8
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The slot for the key could have been drilled out as part of the assembly line I guess, although it would have been relatively simple to make an adjustment to the master mold as well. Definitely a cost saver to reuse the same tooling in any century. High heat + high pressure would have distorted the parts.

"I wonder how the heck it was stuck together - some kind of high pressure high-heat kind of process..?"

- Waterproof industrial grade glue I would think.
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Old 31-05-2012, 07:28 PM   #9
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Of course, if you're meaning the vertical seam on the upper hull - then yes, the upper hull is formed from front and rear sections that are joined by melting the plastic to form the seam in a third metal tool.
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Old 01-06-2012, 09:13 AM   #10
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this is sooo interesting

so the top can be heat sealed presumably as its hollow..? is that right..?

I had the rubber band one as a kid as a hand-me-down and I played with it so often that one day the bottom hull just dropped off - this revealed that inside there is a brick of foam to help it float

this definitely verifies that it was glued on

I think the upper hull seam runs along the top of the windows doesn't it, rather than just straight up and over - there's no seam on the top of the conning tower

I've also speculated that the paint job was done while the plastic was flat on some of the parts - was any of it stamped to shape or would it all be injection moulded..?

these are only cheap plastic toys but the way they were designed and tooled up is so clever - the accuracy involved is phenomenal



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Of course, if you're meaning the vertical seam on the upper hull - then yes, the upper hull is formed from front and rear sections that are joined by melting the plastic to form the seam in a third metal tool.

Last edited by mike s; 01-06-2012 at 09:21 AM. Reason: speljni
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Old 01-06-2012, 01:49 PM   #11
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Keep in mind that much of this is conjecture on my part - I have some knowledge of manufacturing plastic items, limitations of the process etc but I'm no expert. I did some packaging design work for a company that specialized in injection molded plastic products many years ago. They were nice enough to show me the manufacturing process a number of times. The solid metal tooling was so heavy, it required forklift trucks to move it to the injection machines and block & tackle to align it properly.

"so the top can be heat sealed presumably as its hollow..? is that right..?"

Yes, it was a compromise to get around having undercuts that would render the plastic part impossible to remove from the metal tooling. It may also indicate that the upper hull was created from a 3-part metal tool: One full length piece for the inside and 2 interlocking front and rear tools for the outside. The vertical seam would be where the excess flash oozed out at the join. It constantly amazes me that all the engineering, calculations and design work in that era was carried out with just a slide rule and human imagination that could see metal molds forming molten plastic to shape in 3 dimensions. There's also an element of creativity in disguising the seam by running it along the window frames and not straight across. Brilliant!

I doubt that any graphics were applied to flat plastic sheet. That would require vacuforming afterwards and the Lone Star Stingrays are definitely injection molded.

The paint would have been factory applied after the toy was demolded as a three dimensional item. In assembly line production, they would have used contoured masks called 'Tampos' that have openings to form the shape of windows and hull markings when paint is sprayed through them. It was a somewhat crude process in the 60's and sometimes not very accurate. If the Tampo was misaligned it would create an off register paint job. If the Tampo was not firmly in contact with the corresponding surface, the graphics ended up with overspray bleed as the paint spray blew underneath the masked areas.

I had the rubber band version of this toy as a kid and still have the painful memory of accidentally breaking it when I jumped down from the garden wall. The lower hull shattered into a million pieces. Funny, I don't remember it having a sponge insert though.

Cheers,
T'Form1
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Old 01-06-2012, 02:46 PM   #12
TV21Dalek
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Is it injected styrene or that weird stuff some Action Man vehicles were made from? (Scorpion tank hull for example)
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Old 01-06-2012, 02:58 PM   #13
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I'm not familiar with the Action Man vehicle you mention. I do know that the Lone Star Stingray was molded in rigid plastic which was quite thick. It was not very pliable at all - Hence the shattered destruction of mine at the mercy of my big feet as mentioned above.
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Old 01-06-2012, 03:07 PM   #14
mike s
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all very interesting info TF and thanks again

chaps, I must confess: with its jaunty blue plastic body and spangly gold and silver soft edged spray-paint job, the toy simultaneously reminds me of both christmas and summer holidays

how many toys can you say that about


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I'm not familiar with the Action Man vehicle you mention. I do know that the Lone Star Stingray was molded in rigid plastic which was quite thick. It was not very pliable at all - Hence the shattered destruction of mine at the mercy of my big feet as mentioned above.
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Old 06-06-2012, 09:00 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TV21Dalek View Post
Is it injected styrene or that weird stuff some Action Man vehicles were made from? (Scorpion tank hull for example)
Injection-moulded polyethylene?
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Old 06-06-2012, 09:32 AM   #16
mike s
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its def more like an action man tank than an airfix kit

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Injection-moulded polyethylene?
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