Space 1999 Eagle Transporter Forum


Go Back   Space 1999 Eagle Transporter Forum > Deep Space Tracking Station > A Matter of Balance

Notices

SPONSORED BY
&

Reply Bookmark and Share
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 26-04-2010, 03:01 AM   #1
eaglewingone
Communications Officer
 
eaglewingone's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Los Angeles,CA
Posts: 1,206
Default Aliens may exist but contact would hurt humans: Hawking

Aliens may exist but mankind should avoid contact with them as the consequences could be devastating, British scientist Stephen Hawking warned Sunday.

"If aliens visit us, the outcome would be much as when Columbus landed in America, which didn't turn out well for the Native Americans," said the astrophysicist in a new television series, according to British media reports.

The programmes depict an imagined universe featuring alien life forms in huge spaceships on the hunt for resources after draining their own planet dry.

"Such advanced aliens would perhaps become nomads, looking to conquer and colonise whatever planets they can reach," warned Hawking.

The doomsday scenario is suggested in the series "Into the Universe with Stephen Hawking" on the Discovery Channel, which began airing in the United States on Sunday.

On the probability of alien life existing, he says: "To my mathematical brain, the numbers alone make thinking about aliens perfectly rational.

"The real challenge is to work out what aliens might actually be like."

Glowing squid-like creatures, herds of herbivores that can hang onto a cliff face and bright yellow predators that kill their prey with stinging tails are among the creatures that stalk the scientist's fantastical cosmos.

Mankind has already made a number of attempts to contact extraterrestrial civilisations.

In 2008, American space agency NASA beamed the Beatles song "Across the Universe" into deep space to send a message of peace to any alien that happens to be in the region of Polaris -- also known as the North Star -- in 2439.

But the history of humanity's efforts to contact aliens stretches back some years.

The US probes Pioneer 10 and 11 were launched in 1972 and 1973 bearing plaques of a naked man and woman and symbols seeking to convey the positions of the Earth and the Sun.

Voyager 1 and 2, launched in 1977, each carry a gold-plated copper phonogram disk with recordings of sounds and images on Earth.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20100425...lhawking/print
eaglewingone is off duty   Bookmark and Share Reply With Quote
Old 26-04-2010, 06:29 AM   #2
Eagle
Commander Ret.
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 7,723
Default

Nah. All aliens are humanoid these days. Or at least according to Hollywood.
Eagle is off duty   Bookmark and Share Reply With Quote
Old 26-04-2010, 06:45 AM   #3
Bishop
Chief Science Officer
 
Bishop's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: South Australia
Posts: 11,796
Default

Zzzzzzzzzzzzz
Bishop is off duty   Bookmark and Share Reply With Quote
Old 26-04-2010, 06:55 AM   #4
29390
Communications Officer
 
29390's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,340
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by eaglewingone View Post
The US probes Pioneer 10 and 11 were launched in 1972 and 1973 bearing plaques of a naked man and woman and symbols seeking to convey the positions of the Earth and the Sun.
Naked? Hmmm, you don't think we're sending out the wrong messages here do you?
29390 is off duty   Bookmark and Share Reply With Quote
Old 26-04-2010, 06:57 AM   #5
CR
Science Officer
 
CR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: wandering the universe
Posts: 5,472
Default

The Beatles? That's our big 'hello out there' to the universe? How about just sending the Prime Number signal?

To respond to the idea of aliens existing, I think finding proof (in a signal, not in an invasion of Earth*) would shake things up pretty much, especially on social & religious foundations. You know, everything we thought we knew would have to be adjusted to accept the new evidence. (Lost cause, I suppose, as we humans have a penchant for denial if something is too foreign to our sensibilities.)

Anyway, at this point, it's all academic.


*Insert the meme "I, for one, welcome our new alien overlords" here.
CR is off duty   Bookmark and Share Reply With Quote

Old 26-04-2010, 01:29 PM   #6
VTracy
Eagle Pilot
 
VTracy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 596
Default

I saw two other episodes of this series, but not this one. It's interesting, but not too much new. Seems like an updated "Cosmos".

As for Aliens, I don't think they'll need our resources. From what we know about the asteroid, and Kuiper belts, their are way more resources out there, than here. That's why movies like Avatar, and shows like V are a little hokie.

If you need water, plenty of comets out there. If there is a planet around a sun with a certain element you want, that solar system is bound to be chock full of the stuff, and not just somehow isolated on one planet. And probably much easier to grab an asteroid, grind it up and take what you need, than to go all the way to the surface of a planet and mine it.
VTracy is off duty   Bookmark and Share Reply With Quote
Old 26-04-2010, 11:31 PM   #7
karr1981
Assistant Commander
 
karr1981's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 2,202
Default hmm

I wont go into details for sake of sounding like a crazy person, but I do believe 2010 is going to be the year of disclosure on this subject, and I do believe there has been a scaling up of activities to "condition" us for this disclosure.
karr1981 is off duty   Bookmark and Share Reply With Quote
Old 27-04-2010, 12:02 AM   #8
eaglewingone
Communications Officer
 
eaglewingone's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Los Angeles,CA
Posts: 1,206
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 29390 View Post
Naked? Hmmm, you don't think we're sending out the wrong messages here do you?
There is more to the Pioneer Plaque. It was developed by Carl Sagan,Frank Drake and Sagan's wife Ann Sagan and the original idea came from Eric Burgess.At the top left of the plate is a schematic representation of the hyperfine transition of hydrogen, which is the most abundant element in the universe. Below this symbol is a small vertical line to represent the binary digit 1. This spin-flip transition of a hydrogen atom from electron state spin up to electron state spin down can specify a unit of length (wavelength, 21 cm) as well as a unit of time (frequency, 1420 MHz)On the right side of the plaque, a man and a woman are shown in front of the spacecraft. Between the brackets that indicate the height of the woman, the binary representation of the number 8 can be seen (1000, with a small defect in the first zero). In units of the wavelength of the hyperfine transition of hydrogen this means 8 21 cm = 168 cm.The radial pattern on the left of the plaque shows 15 lines emanating from the same origin. Fourteen of the lines have corresponding long binary numbers, which stand for the periods of pulsars, using the hydrogen spin-flip transition frequency as the unit. Since these periods will change over time, the epoch of the launch can be calculated from these values


http://www.daviddarling.info/encyclo...eerplaque.html

Last edited by eaglewingone; 27-04-2010 at 12:12 AM.
eaglewingone is off duty   Bookmark and Share Reply With Quote
Old 27-04-2010, 12:17 AM   #9
eaglewingone
Communications Officer
 
eaglewingone's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Los Angeles,CA
Posts: 1,206
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by VTracy View Post
I saw two other episodes of this series, but not this one. It's interesting, but not too much new. Seems like an updated "Cosmos".
"Cosmos" was a very special series.

Last edited by eaglewingone; 27-04-2010 at 12:25 AM.
eaglewingone is off duty   Bookmark and Share Reply With Quote
Old 27-04-2010, 12:26 AM   #10
Eagle
Commander Ret.
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 7,723
Default

I'm not looking forward to 'contact'. Narrow-minded, religious zealots will only claim it's their "God".

Bad times ahead...
Eagle is off duty   Bookmark and Share Reply With Quote

Old 27-04-2010, 12:50 AM   #11
eaglewingone
Communications Officer
 
eaglewingone's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Los Angeles,CA
Posts: 1,206
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eagle View Post
Nah. All aliens are humanoid these days. Or at least according to Hollywood.
Life forms do not necessarily mean that they are made from carbon. Perhaps they are made from silicon.Wherever astronomers have looked – in meteorites, in comets, in the atmospheres of the giant planets, in the interstellar medium, and in the outer layers of cool stars – they have found molecules of oxidized silicon (silicon dioxide and silicates) but no substances such as silanes or silicones which might be the precursors of a silicon biochemistry.Could computers be considered "lifeforms" because they contain computer chips made from silicon if manipulated by man.There are lifeforms on this planet that depend on silicon such as bacteria near volcanic vents at the bottom of the ocean.

http://nai.arc.nasa.gov/astrobio/fea...licon_life.cfm

Last edited by eaglewingone; 27-04-2010 at 01:15 AM.
eaglewingone is off duty   Bookmark and Share Reply With Quote
Old 27-04-2010, 04:06 AM   #12
Doomsday
Communications Officer
 
Doomsday's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Dundee
Posts: 992
Default

Eaglewingone, I don't think the Aliens will be able to find us using that plaque, unless it has been able to erase Pluto from itself.

That was a clever one from Earthling scientists to fool the invading Alien hordes.

They will look at our system, and say "That one only has 8 planets, not 9 as in the map"
Doomsday is off duty   Bookmark and Share Reply With Quote
Old 27-04-2010, 04:08 AM   #13
eaglewingone
Communications Officer
 
eaglewingone's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Los Angeles,CA
Posts: 1,206
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Doomsday View Post
Eaglewingone, I don't think the Aliens will be able to find us using that plaque, unless it has been able to erase Pluto from itself.

That was a clever one from Earthling scientists to fool the invading Alien hordes.

They will look at our system, and say "That one only has 8 planets, not 9 as in the map"
Frankly, they will not care who is on the map or the location of the planets.If they aim for the third one they will find a blue pearl in the cosmic ocean. As long as they get the general directions by using the 14 pulsars.Showing the location with as many as 14 pulsars provides redundancy so that the location of the origin can be triangulated even if only some of the pulsars are recognized.The lengths of the lines show the relative distances of the pulsars to the sun. A tick mark at the end of each line gives the Z coordinate perpendicular to the galactic plane. Think of it as a message in a bottle in the cosmic ocean. Its doutful that "they" will get the plaque.The Voyager probe plaque is more intricate and complex than the Pioneer plaque. Carl Sagan,Ann Sagan,Frank Drake and only had three weeks to develop the Pioneer plaque when getting the go ahead from NASA.

Last edited by eaglewingone; 27-04-2010 at 05:11 AM.
eaglewingone is off duty   Bookmark and Share Reply With Quote
Old 27-04-2010, 07:05 AM   #14
29390
Communications Officer
 
29390's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,340
Default

That guy on the Pioneer plaque shouldn't have his hand raised. Who knows how that gesture could be interpreted by an Alien race, assuming that they are intelligent enough or otherwise? Think of the irony if it were mistaken as a invitation for intergalactic war, complete with a map of where to find the 'aggressors' I think Hawking is right. We should keep a low profile in the universe, we have absolutely no idea what's out there, so to assume that any Aliens we meet would have a benevolent attitude towards the Human race seems totally arrogant to me. We are making that assumption by putting that plaque on the Pioneer probe in the first place.
29390 is off duty   Bookmark and Share Reply With Quote
Old 27-04-2010, 07:12 AM   #15
CR
Science Officer
 
CR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: wandering the universe
Posts: 5,472
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by karr1981 View Post
I wont go into details for sake of sounding like a crazy person, but I do believe 2010 is going to be the year of disclosure on this subject, and I do believe there has been a scaling up of activities to "condition" us for this disclosure.
This is in response to the idea posted, and is not a snipe against the poster!

Funny, it seems every year is 'the one' where stuff gets disclosed, but nothing actually gets disclosed. When that occurs, the goal posts shift so that the decade is 'the one' where the big disclosure will happen. Then, the generation is 'the one' and so on. But it never actually comes to pass, likely because there's nothing to actually disclose. Of course, if & when something actually happens, those who've been hoping for it all their lives will say "See? We were right!"
I want there to be life in the universe besides here on Earth, and I want there to be sentient life among that. But so far, the evidence is that there is NONE.
Until there's evidence for the contrary, I don't believe that 'The Government' is hiding evidence of alien civilizations. First, there's no single 'Government.' Second, no one government, let alone the many that make up the world, could keep a secret that big secret for any length of time. Third, space agencies & scientists would love to make the announcement if it were real just to get funding for further research. Fourth... oh, you get the idea.

And given that maybe, just maybe, we're 'it' in the Universe, shouldn't we all take better care of ourselves & each other? (After a pause to consider my own words, I'll add: For that matter, even if we aren't 'it,' shouldn't we still take better care of ourselves & each other? Either way, I hope we outgrow our headlong rush to self-destruction.)
CR is off duty   Bookmark and Share Reply With Quote

Old 27-04-2010, 07:25 AM   #16
CR
Science Officer
 
CR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: wandering the universe
Posts: 5,472
Default

Maybe the woman's lowered arms are a sign of insult to someone, too. Who's to say that the raised hand actually represented a form of greeting? I think it more or less just shows a sense of how a human form can move, and how there is sexual dimorphism in our species.
Anyway, our radio & TV broadcasts are a far more effective means of shouting "Hey! We're over here!" than a speck of scrap metal drifting aimlessly through the cosmos. If we ever make it off world in a large-scale fashion, I suspect that the old probes we sent out will more likely be sought after by human historians than by alien aggressors.

And now to muse rhetorical...
Just curious about something... what's with humanity's collective paranoia about alien invasion? Did everyone watch too much SF over the years? Are we projecting our own behaviour of conquest on any & every other life form?

You know, I sometimes used to think I wouldn't want to know about life elsewhere, because such a radical change to our social ideas would rob my children of being able to have a 'normal' life. Then I realised how backward-thinking that was, to want everything to stay the same and never progress. Denial isn't a good state in which to live...
CR is off duty   Bookmark and Share Reply With Quote
Old 27-04-2010, 02:09 PM   #17
VTracy
Eagle Pilot
 
VTracy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 596
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Doomsday View Post
Eaglewingone, I don't think the Aliens will be able to find us using that plaque, unless it has been able to erase Pluto from itself.

That was a clever one from Earthling scientists to fool the invading Alien hordes.

They will look at our system, and say "That one only has 8 planets, not 9 as in the map"
Hehe, right.

Not to mention the other gas giants have rings too, not just Saturn!

They'll never find us!!
VTracy is off duty   Bookmark and Share Reply With Quote
Old 27-04-2010, 02:10 PM   #18
VTracy
Eagle Pilot
 
VTracy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 596
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by eaglewingone View Post
"Cosmos" was a very special series.
I agree. I loved that series. Even watched some re-run episodes not too long ago.
VTracy is off duty   Bookmark and Share Reply With Quote
Old 27-04-2010, 06:42 PM   #19
pjskeldon
Communications Officer
 
pjskeldon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Oxfordshire, UK
Posts: 752
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by CR View Post
...Insert the meme "I, for one, welcome our new alien overlords" here.
Just got it - Kent Brockman referring to Kodos and Kang.
D'oh!

I'd love there to be life out there, and I'm minded to think we're not on a unique planet. Rare but not unique.

So if life has evolved elsewhere how far has it got - microbes or beings like ourselves with off-planet travel, or even further advanced.

Given our technological progress I'm surprised SOME evidence of advanced life-forms hasn't become apparent. Even if it's just spotting a hyperspace by-pass!

Sadly, while astronomers stare into space with ever more powerful telescopes, boffins ponder the possibilities of parallel universes and whether we can travel between them (apart from in 'FRINGE') and poke at sub-atomic particles with big machines. Perhaps the really advanced aliens are already exploring these new frontiers and all the mucking about in real spaceships is just humanity's old ways (explore, expand and colonise our own planet) taken to the next level.

If a friendly alien stops by, great. However, as others have said, I wonder how they would be received. Even landing a big silver saucer in Central Park won't stop some from interpreting it as the vanguard of an invasion.

Bad aliens - frankly if they have the capability to come here, we're boned.

Whether we should stop talking to the cosmos - too late. We've been sending out radio and TV signals for long enough. Cue Omicron Persei 8, Lrrr and 'Single Female Lawyer'. Which is more or less where I started.
pjskeldon is off duty   Bookmark and Share Reply With Quote
Old 27-04-2010, 06:59 PM   #20
Doomsday
Communications Officer
 
Doomsday's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Dundee
Posts: 992
Default

I think Kent Brockman was hailing our Giant Ant Overlords, from Homers trip into space, and he smashes the ant colony container (and they go extreme close up on the monitor)
Doomsday is off duty   Bookmark and Share Reply With Quote

Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


All times are GMT. The time now is 09:17 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
This site and contents are copyright Bernard Walsh 2010 all rights reserved, no reproduction of material in any form without written permission email: Bernie.walsh@mac.com