Space 1999 Eagle Transporter Forum


Go Back   Space 1999 Eagle Transporter Forum > Recreation and Dining Complex > Another Time, Another Place - Classic British Film and Television Discussions

Notices

SPONSORED BY
&

Reply Bookmark and Share
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 01-11-2008, 06:40 AM   #1
Bishop
Chief Science Officer
 
Bishop's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: South Australia
Posts: 11,796
Default The Quantum of Solace

So have people seen this? The reviews from various international news papers (esp UK) in our AU weekend Australian were rather poor... what have people found?
Bishop is off duty   Bookmark and Share Reply With Quote
Old 01-11-2008, 07:04 AM   #2
Known Space
Eagle Pilot
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Up North! Well, Yorkshire!
Posts: 587
Default

I'm afraid its very poor- I'm not a huge fan of Bond (with the exception of Moonraker) but after enjoying Casino Royale very much (borrowed off a neighbour ) I was keen that this would be a further step forward. Alas it is again like watching a very expensive computer game with absolutely no story line existing ,other than to link the next steroid thrill of action to drive the next over intense action piece forward. Very like the Bourne Ultimatum (which was possibly the least interesting of that series). Next to Indy IV the most disappointing film of this year and I now totally distrust Empire mags review section ( this after some 200 faithfully collected additions).
Known Space is off duty   Bookmark and Share Reply With Quote
Old 01-11-2008, 08:07 AM   #3
fireflashfive
Eagle Pilot
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Manchester, England
Posts: 559
Default

I saw the film yesterday morning. Overall I thought it was good and I enjoyed watching it. I didn't like the quick cuts in some of the action sequences though. And that theme song.......no comment! I didn't think it was as good as Casino Royale, but I came away from the cinema quite happy with what I had seen.

Doug.
fireflashfive is off duty   Bookmark and Share Reply With Quote
Old 01-11-2008, 09:19 AM   #4
w8cmp
Science Officer
 
w8cmp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Romford, London, England
Posts: 5,523
Default

Saw it yesterday evening.

Great action, amazing stunts, very weak storyline...

And as has been said, dreadful theme music.

They need to get back to some good old Bond values - a few gadgets wouldn't go amiss, and a bit of 'wow' factor with the sets and villains etc. This had none of that and was just another action movie...

Having said that, it was entertaining and I am glad we saw it.
w8cmp is off duty   Bookmark and Share Reply With Quote
Old 01-11-2008, 07:23 PM   #5
pjskeldon
Communications Officer
 
pjskeldon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Oxfordshire, UK
Posts: 752
Default

Just come back from seeing it in Oxford...

Here's what I think:
1) Theme tune - awful
2) Action edited too quickly - some sequences just leave you wondering what's going on.
3) Story - very hard to draw out what is going on. Lots of action but little suspense. It does depend on seeing the previous film, but even then the motives for some of the characters' actions are still a mystery to me. Even the end of the film seems a bit of an anti-climax.
4) Good use of M - best scenes with her in any film yet I think
5) Dialogue - too much philosophising. Some lighter one-liners without becoming Roger Moore.
6) Few establishing shots - especially the big finale. Could have made much more of that building

Overall - ambitious, but not a memorable Bond.

Phil.
pjskeldon is off duty   Bookmark and Share Reply With Quote

Old 01-11-2008, 07:52 PM   #6
DX-SFX
Chief Medical Officer
 
DX-SFX's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 9,094
Default

I agree with the last three posts. Within a minute of the film starting, the editing looked more like a pop video with style attempting to conquer the lack of content but fortunately it settled down. The action sequences were definitely the victim of too much quick cutting and some obvious cgi stunts. One or two contrivances pushing the limits of credibility. The moment fuel cells were mentioned, you knew the place was going up at the end. Not as good as Casino Royale IMO (I know I'm biased) but still enjoyable. I didn't like the theme when I first heard it but thought I'd give it the benefit of the doubt until I saw it in the context of the movie. Unfortunately, I liked it even less. The titles looked a little cheap and lacklustre. I know the same claim was aimed at CasRoy but the titles suited the film. The QOS titles don't.
DX-SFX is off duty   Bookmark and Share Reply With Quote
Old 01-11-2008, 09:31 PM   #7
Eagle
Commander Ret.
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 7,723
Default

I thought the titles on CR were nothing short of stunning.
Eagle is off duty   Bookmark and Share Reply With Quote
Old 01-11-2008, 09:52 PM   #8
DX-SFX
Chief Medical Officer
 
DX-SFX's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 9,094
Default

I loved them too. Made a nice change from the usual writhing pole dancer and the theme was suitably 'come and have a go if you think you're hard enough'.
DX-SFX is off duty   Bookmark and Share Reply With Quote
Old 01-11-2008, 11:43 PM   #9
BrianS
Communications Officer
 
BrianS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Los Angeles, CA, USA
Posts: 1,435
Default

Are you trying to say there is something wrong with a "writhing pole dancer"?!?!

BrianS is off duty   Bookmark and Share Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2008, 08:28 AM   #10
Known Space
Eagle Pilot
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Up North! Well, Yorkshire!
Posts: 587
Default

Well with hindsight perhaps I may have been slightly harsh,but not by much . My advise is to watch C R and then go straight to the cinema to see Solace and it will make more sense and be more enjoyable .
Having rewatched CR to try and understand my reaction to Solace, its primarily because Solace is such a direct sequel to the events and literally THE SECOND HALF of a longer movie of which CR is the first part.It can in no way be considered "a stand alone" like nearly all the other Bonds and CR.
They did this with the third Bourne, Ultimatum, and to be honest, I think thats why I liked it far less than the other two. It picked up abrubtly where the last film finished and then made you think more about what happened in the previous film ,rather than focus on the new, and you constantly ended up thinking about the wrong film whilst watching it.And thats quite a gap if you haven't seen the older one more recently.
I think that CR updated Bond by using an awful lot of Bourne as an action template and a modern style thriller and it did work very well- not only with the action sequences which appeared to be convincing, but because Daniel Craig invested Bond with real character and a touch of humanity.
Solace is a straight "revenge" movie. No humour ,no messing about ( though some of the long dialogue and discussions still throw me) and there was no time to do anything with Bond other than make him a hitman, a remorceless, humourless killing machine that moved from one place to another swiftly with the corpses piling up behind him.
Frankly, that theme started me off straight away , and then it went quickly down hill from there. They tried to up the "thrilling action sequences" by cutting them too quickly (which left me struggling to figure out which car had got wrecked or which person had been shot and even which way they were going sometimes) and then by adding the bloody stupid CGI enhanced stunts where your brain says "thats just impossible". Scaffold fight and shot anyone? As mentioned on previous threads numerously this is my number one hatred of all things going wrong with films these days and to see that in Solace after they got CR so right really ,really,really grated.
They also tried to be clever with the double crossing character motivations which again made little sense other than to put it in the film because its expected these days,added the Bond body shot and over played and over did all the elements that worked well in CR but then didn't balance off the film like it should have. The Bond girls were simply that ,just Bond girls and not characters , and one of those was lifted directly from an older Bond film.
So I was still badly disappointed by it (but not half as badly as Indy IV which actually had me groaning in physical pain in places)but thats been the case for most of the films this year, with the exception of Ironman(new), the Dark Knight (new storyline) and Hellboy II (new story and better production values). Its an average action thriller by its self,but certainly not four stars worth of unmissable entertainment.Watch CR before just before it and it is far more acceptable. I guess with DVD so readily available to replay countless times thats just what the writers and producers did and they should have advised everyone else to going to see Solace to do exactly the same.I didn't and perhaps I should have.This one shows Bond becoming a hardened and stone faced killer and revenge artist (and Craig with those icy stares does that very well) but left me with no liking for the character he had become and if you don't like the hero you've pretty much lost the arguement for the film.
My main hope now is that the next starts from a totally clean slate, has a stronger story telling element and a good bad villian with some darkly killer humours one liners. And I'm done.
Known Space is off duty   Bookmark and Share Reply With Quote

Old 02-11-2008, 08:58 AM   #11
DX-SFX
Chief Medical Officer
 
DX-SFX's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 9,094
Default

I like the fact that they made Bond a flawed character rather than a cheesy one dimensional cartoon character who wins a fight by clever fisty cuffs then brushes his hair back in place while uttering some dreadfully unfunny pun. It's also nice to see Bond using alcohol as a prop to help him cope in both CR and QOS (in the giving him character sense rather than getting drunk is a good way to deal with your problems way). Craig is the first actor to really humanise him. I also didn't have a problem with QOS being a direct sequel because it was always supposed to follow the honing of Bond into the character we've come to know. It is afterall the start of his career and a reboot of the franchise.
DX-SFX is off duty   Bookmark and Share Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2008, 09:18 AM   #12
w8cmp
Science Officer
 
w8cmp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Romford, London, England
Posts: 5,523
Default

Oh and another thing my wife picked up on (being the complete Bond fanatic she is):

If this is meant to be a direct sequel, picking up directly where the previous film left off, then why is Bond wearing a different suit at the start ? When did he have an opportunity to change his clothes...
w8cmp is off duty   Bookmark and Share Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2008, 09:24 AM   #13
Bishop
Chief Science Officer
 
Bishop's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: South Australia
Posts: 11,796
Default

That's all fine, but the thing about Bond that's made him attractive for so long is that he isn't an ugly nasty killer, but a witty clever brave and sophisticated killer who has cool gadgets and fights on the side of right. All this supposedly real world stuff is just more of what we get outside the theatre and we go to the theatre to escape, not have the grittiness shoved in our faces.

The numbers of people who go to these movies will only drop if we lose all the mystic of the character. They're going to have to be a little careful in the next Batman as well, that it doesn't get too dark and that things sort out with the cops etc in the end, or they'll lose the general fans who haven't read the graphic novels. We want superheros, with some flaws yes, but not constantly portrayed as seemly complete arseholes

It is in truth a difficult tightrope to walk with Bond. Good old Sean got the mixture right I think. I'm sure this guy could get the balance right standing on his ear, he's no mean actor.
Bishop is off duty   Bookmark and Share Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2008, 11:42 AM   #14
DX-SFX
Chief Medical Officer
 
DX-SFX's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 9,094
Default

The gadgets came later. The reason Connery worked so well was that he could be charming but there was a touch of sadism about him the others lacked. That's why you wouldn't pick a fight with Connery's Bond but you'd actively want to punch the lights out of Roger Moore. Bond started off very straight and each film got camper and camper which is why I'm glad they've shed all the garbage that usually comes with later Bond films and relooked at the central core. I find people who grew up with the Moore Bond seem to think that's how it should be but that is actually what it became. The whole point of the licence to kill thing is that he's given permission to be the judge, jury and executioner if the occasion demands it.
DX-SFX is off duty   Bookmark and Share Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2008, 01:09 PM   #15
pjskeldon
Communications Officer
 
pjskeldon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Oxfordshire, UK
Posts: 752
Default

Quite DX-SFX, although he could try to be a bit more of a charmer. If he retains the steely stare all the time, he'll soon become boring. better to have light and shade. There is a moment when Bond seems close to tears as he cradles a dying character, but for every other scene he looks like a man who's lost everything.

Gadgets - this film is thankfully light on gadgetry, apart from reliance on tracking people with mobile phone technology. Good to see MI6 have bought ST:TNG's graphics!

Villain's comeuppance - not as satisfying as in previous Bond's.

Without wanting to spoil anything, there is plenty of scope to tap the events and the 'organisation' in future films. However, I hope they move on.

Phil.

Strawberry Fields forever!

Last edited by pjskeldon; 02-11-2008 at 01:09 PM. Reason: Spelling!
pjskeldon is off duty   Bookmark and Share Reply With Quote

Old 02-11-2008, 03:59 PM   #16
DX-SFX
Chief Medical Officer
 
DX-SFX's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 9,094
Default

He does soften as Mathis is dying and comforts Camille as she's traumatised by the flames and memories of her house being burnt down. As with Vesper in the shower, it shows a more compassionate side. I think the whole point of this film is the fact that he is driven by his demons and defiant in this one and he's learning to be much colder. I doubt this one outing is likely to be a completely representative template of what's to come.
DX-SFX is off duty   Bookmark and Share Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2008, 05:45 PM   #17
pjskeldon
Communications Officer
 
pjskeldon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Oxfordshire, UK
Posts: 752
Default

By the way.
With characters called White and Greene, I was beginning to wonder if the organisation was ... Spectrum!

Phil.
pjskeldon is off duty   Bookmark and Share Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2008, 06:24 PM   #18
BrianS
Communications Officer
 
BrianS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Los Angeles, CA, USA
Posts: 1,435
Default

Not yet having seen the film (hasnt come out in the States yet), but reading some of the comments about the nature of this second film as well as how it picks up right where the first one left off, I wonder if, given the way the new film ends [without providing any spoilers please] this seems to be the second act of a three act story? If it were, that could certainly go a long way to explain the relentless moving forward of the second act (second film) to the goal established in the first act (first film).
BrianS is off duty   Bookmark and Share Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2008, 06:28 PM   #19
Air Terrainean
Life Support Officer
 
Air Terrainean's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: End of runway two-nine
Posts: 1,972
Default

So does that mean the next one will be The Bond Ultimatum ?
Air Terrainean is off duty   Bookmark and Share Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2008, 06:38 PM   #20
Dr Kane
Communications Officer
 
Dr Kane's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 1,458
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by BrianS View Post
I wonder if, given the way the new film ends [without providing any spoilers please] this seems to be the second act of a three act story?
So it's 'The (British) Empire Strikes Back' then?

I still plan on going to see it.

Anyone ever read the Nick Stone novels by 'Andy McNab'? Some are awful, but a few are quite gripping. Daniel Craig's Bond reminds me of the Nick Stone character in quite a few ways: betrayal by a woman he loves (followed by her death), implied PTSD, ambivalence towards his role in SIS, unglamorous urban surveillance work, kicking seven shades out of people in bathrooms....

Last edited by Dr Kane; 02-11-2008 at 06:41 PM. Reason: 'Cos I don't write good
Dr Kane is off duty   Bookmark and Share Reply With Quote

Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


All times are GMT. The time now is 09:10 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
This site and contents are copyright Bernard Walsh 2010 all rights reserved, no reproduction of material in any form without written permission email: Bernie.walsh@mac.com