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Old 17-12-2008, 02:20 PM   #1
David A. Sobral
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Default Eagle Countdown

Greetings, Fellow Travellers-I've started re-watching my "Space:1999" megaset again & since I haven't seen anyone else do it, I'm gonna do it myself...a Countdown of Blown-Up & Totalled Eagles. Last night was "Full Circle" (I average about 2-3 episodes per evening...no Eagles lost there.). After "Breakaway", the highest numbered Eagle was #29 ("Collision Course"), which I'm assuming they built after "Breakaway" based on dialogue from "The Last Sunset". It's just a quirky little thing I've wanted to do for a while. It reminds me of the first time I watched the show with my (ex) wife on the Columbia House VHS tapes...every time an Eagle got blown apart, we'd say in unison "There goes another one!" So, in that spirit, I've begun the countdown & welcome any POVs when I'm finished...THIS SHOULD BE FUN!
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Old 17-12-2008, 04:37 PM   #2
anubispro
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Looking forward to your list.
I have always wondered about the Eagles and the number of personnel lost as well.
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Old 17-12-2008, 04:58 PM   #3
David A. Sobral
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Default Eagle Countdown II

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Originally Posted by anubispro View Post
Looking forward to your list.
I have always wondered about the Eagles and the number of personnel lost as well.
If you sign on to the "Space:1999" site "Ring Around the Moon" (a hub for all "Space:1999" sites, including "Main Mission Forum" which you should AVOID AT ALL COSTS), there is a site called "Alpha Personnel Countdown" which lists who dies & in what episode...I think the ACTUAL crew count is down to like 261, way below what Dr. Russell claims in many Year 2 episodes. Anyway, I'm almost done with Year 1 episodes, so I should have ALL the details by the end of the year. I've been taking notes & was really suprised, after watching "Last Sunset" that there was an "Eagle 29" (I think it was "Collision Course"). Keep your eyes on this site...this is gonna be a blast! I plan to detail how & why Eagles get lost and I should have an ACTUAL total count of Eagles assigned to Alpha prior to "Breakaway".
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Old 17-12-2008, 11:25 PM   #4
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Possible spoilers ahead... highlight to read (at your own peril)!

Not to spoil your fun, but Martin Willey's The Catacombs website also has this info charted out, but not necesasarily in a dedicated fashion. In other words, crew fatalities are listed, but within another list of crewmembers, and Eagle losses are noted somewhere in the Eagles pages.

So, have a look if you like, or else do so after you've finished to see if anything got missed.
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Old 18-12-2008, 06:09 AM   #5
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dont look dont look do the list yourself! It gives you a good reason to watch all the episodes again
I wish I had em all on DVD

Cameron
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Old 18-12-2008, 09:34 AM   #6
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They're very easy to get hold of and very cheap if you go for the ordinary sets, thought the series one network one (is that what its called), is worth the money so I'm told.
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Old 18-12-2008, 09:58 AM   #7
eryr dau
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Are you going to a Eagle crash per pilot log ?

no prizes for guessing who the top crash master will be
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Old 18-12-2008, 01:44 PM   #8
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Actually, wasn't it Koenig? I'd bet that Koenig & Carter are at least tied for crashes...
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Old 18-12-2008, 01:57 PM   #9
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Quote:
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Actually, wasn't it Koenig? I'd bet that Koenig & Carter are at least tied for crashes...
Yeah, stop bashing Carter for crashing Eagles!!!!!!!!!! He was forced to do most of the flying you know!!!!!!!!!!!

What we really need to find out is the ratio of crashes per flights made!

Then we'll find out who's a good pilot (Carter) and who isn't (Koenig)!!!
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Old 18-12-2008, 02:01 PM   #10
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It's completely meaningless anyway since you don't know how many other flights are being made and by how many other people and with what degree of potential hazard. It's like saying a Formula 1 car driver is a worse driver than a learner driver because the race driver has more crashes.
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Old 19-12-2008, 12:27 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David A. Sobral View Post
After "Breakaway", the highest numbered Eagle was #29 ("Collision Course"), which I'm assuming they built after "Breakaway" based on dialogue from "The Last Sunset".
Could Eagle 29 be the one brought up by Commisioner Simmonds? If Moonbase Alpha had a total of 28, this may account for it. Just a though!
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Old 19-12-2008, 12:51 PM   #12
David A. Sobral
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Could Eagle 29 be the one brought up by Commisioner Simmonds? If Moonbase Alpha had a total of 28, this may account for it. Just a though!
Actually, Eagle 29 being Simmonds' ship is a good guess but, considering it appears AFTER "The Last Sunset", in which it is clearly stated there are 28 Eagles (#28 being the one Carter crashed while scouting possible locations to relocate the Alphans) with "27 serviceable Eagles back at the base", I would say a "safer bet" would be that they actually built Eagle 29...perhaps from parts left intact from those either totalled or outright destroyed. This would be logical considering that the Alphans pretty much have to scrounge up what they need, at least as far as machinery is concerned. And, no I will not include a list of pilots killed with the destroyed Eagles mainly because, particularly in "Breakaway", they're not all given proper names. What's also strange is, since Eagle 28 was destroyed by Dr. Russell, it doesn't make a lot of sense that the count would go from Eagle 27 to Eagle 29. My assumption is that they actually REPLACED Eagle 28 in the same way they constructed Eagle 29...from leftovers.
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Old 19-12-2008, 03:22 PM   #13
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(deleted - wrong thread)
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Old 20-12-2008, 08:39 AM   #14
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Its pretty much impossible to tell how many eagles are around at any one time. Piri supposedly shows the flight leaving for the planet, but there aren't anywhere near 28 (minus the one left for Koenig) There are however many the script writers remember to mention.... and the sfx guys remember to superimpose when shooting scenes. We also have no idea how many of the things actually work at any one time either.

And yes, I believe its John who wins in the crashing department, but not by much... Paul: After all their crashing I believe there are actually 5 serviceable eagles available Dr Bergman
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Old 22-12-2008, 01:21 PM   #15
David A. Sobral
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Default Eagle Countdown III

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Originally Posted by Tony42 View Post
Its pretty much impossible to tell how many eagles are around at any one time. Piri supposedly shows the flight leaving for the planet, but there aren't anywhere near 28 (minus the one left for Koenig) There are however many the script writers remember to mention.... and the sfx guys remember to superimpose when shooting scenes. We also have no idea how many of the things actually work at any one time either.

And yes, I believe its John who wins in the crashing department, but not by much... Paul: After all their crashing I believe there are actually 5 serviceable eagles available Dr Bergman
Actually, although they're all never depicted at one time in any scene, it actually IS pretty easy to determine how many Eagles are, or were based on Alpha based on dialogue & the number of ships destroyed on screen. I just finished watching "Infernal Machine" & decided to start posting my findings. Again, this count only includes ships that are visibly destroyed or when the dialogue states that an Eagle has been "totalled" (ie; "Bringers Of Wonder").
To begin, counting backwards from "Last Sunset" & adding the Commissioner's Eagle from "Breakaway" I've determined that Moonbase Alpha had a complement of 35 Eagles. Here's the breakdown:1) "Breakaway"-4 Eagles destroyed during the explosion at Waste Area 2 (6 began the dispersal of the atomic waste, 2 returned for "replacements" but it was not indicated that they continued the task). There was also one Eagle tossed into space with the Space Dock & Meta Probe. It didn't blow up but, considering the way it was tossing about, I count it among the destroyed. At this point, we add Simmonds Eagle to the total count. 29 Eagles left (stay with me). 2) "Black Sun"-Eagle 1 destroyed. 28 Eagles left. 3) "Last Sunset"-Eagle 28 blown up by Dr. Russell. 27 left. 4) "Voyager's Return": Eagle 2 destroyed. 26 Eagles left. 5) "Collision Course": Eagle 29 added to the total, likey constructed after "Breakaway" due to the "Last Sunset" episode clearly stating the top count being 28. Now, there are 27 Eagles. 6) "Space Brain": Eagle 1 crushed. 26 Eagles left (again). 7) "Infernal Machine": 3 Eagles destroyed by Gwent. 23 Eagles left. Wow! Not even through the Year One episodes & Alpha's already lost a dozen ships! The countdown continues...Any comments anyone? Remember, "crashed" Eagles don't count because they can (assumingly) be repaired unless it's clearly stated the ship was "totalled". I'll keep you posted.
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Old 22-12-2008, 01:25 PM   #16
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Sounds reasonable. Using "Last Sunset" as a checkpoint and working backwards to get the 35 count makes sense.
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Old 22-12-2008, 02:18 PM   #17
David A. Sobral
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Quote:
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Sounds reasonable. Using "Last Sunset" as a checkpoint and working backwards to get the 35 count makes sense.
I agree. Considering that it was never definitively stated in the series exactly how many Eagles exsist, it seemed a likely starting point. I do remember, however, reading that Alpha had a compliment of 50 Eagles. However, that was in a publication based on the series (like the "Technical Notebook" or some article, or even "The Making of "Space:1999") but, I'm only counting what's on screen or in the dialogue as "canon". Besides, 35 is a nice round number. Plus, I'm also counting the fact that Alpha was a "self-sustaining" environment so, they could construct new ships. I say this because throughtout the show, especially in Year 2, we see labs & other sets never before seen (such as the underground lab in "The Exiles" or even "Command Centre"). To that end, I've concluded that Alpha cannot only repair its' damage but it can "extend" itself beyond its' original parameters.
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Old 22-12-2008, 03:04 PM   #18
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I suspect that the individual writers of the episodes gave no consideration of the amount of Eagles Alpha was supposed to have and the amount destroyed. If the story demanded a few Eagles got wiped out, so be it.

You might actually find more Eagles were destroyed than existed in the first place !

Keith
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Old 22-12-2008, 03:06 PM   #19
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Something that struck me recently is that where would the raw materials come from-basic minerals and metal ores would be present,also lunar rock could be used for concrete,aggregates etc,but the moon obviously has no fossil residues at all-so anything oil based in production -plastics,vinyls,etc would be dependent upon external supplies-so you could possibly make wire,but not the insulation for it etc.
No wood=no paper so once the loo paper runs out........
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Old 22-12-2008, 03:18 PM   #20
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Assuming that each Eagle carries 10 people, you would need at least 32 to evacuate the entire Alpha crew (after all, you would want to take them all off at once if a grave emergency threatened the base)

BTW, you don't need Oil to make plastics, just Carbon and Hydrogen which would both be available. In fact, you can make polymers from algae
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