Space 1999 Eagle Transporter Forum

Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!

  • We have updated the Terms and Conditions, you will be prompted to read and agree to these next time you are active on the forum.
SPONSORED BY

Soldering Basics.

rockwellcm

Alphans
The missing and most important part - regular solderers should be aware of the hazards caused by soldering fumes.


I think regular solder users are well aware of the hazards, and any workplace should have done a risk assessment long ago regarding this to comply with H&S at Work regulations

If you look at the H&S guidelines on this matter, there are guidelines on 8 hour max exposure recommendations on `Rosin` type fluxes.

As for the casual DIY solder/flux user, little or no risk, as how many 44" eagles would they building?

I have been using solder / flux professionaly for the last 35 years and never had any issues.
i
 

Becco_UK

Alphans
rockwellcm: As with anything regarding Health and Safety - what has no effect on one person may very well affect another. The purpose of my post was to make everyone aware that hazards exist. Also, It is not known at what exposure fumes from Rosin based fluxes can cause problems.
 

Becco_UK

Alphans
The precise constituents of the fume causing
occupational asthma and irritation are not known.
From a review of scientific evidence it has not been
possible to identify a safe level of exposure below
which occupational asthma will not occur. Exposure to
all rosin-based solder flux fumes should, therefore, be
avoided or kept as low as is reasonably practicable.


Source: http://www.hse.gov.uk/pubns/indg248.pdf
 

DX-SFX

Alphans
Like all things in life, you have to temper it with common sense. If you drink too much water, it can poison you. Perhaps Health and safety should ban that? We're talking tiny amounts of solder and flux and I'm assuming that no one reading this is so stupid as to not know about taking sensible precautions. Paint thinner fumes presents a higher risk.

Silver Solder, by comparison, is potentially more lethal but again only if you use it day in and day out, breathing the fumes and overheating it. It contains cadmium which is highly poisonous. This is why they've developed cadmium free silver solders in the same way that lead free solders have been developed. Even so, I've used Silverflo No2 for years with no ill effects and indeed even built a complete Eagle using it.

If all this stuff was that dangerous, it wouldn't be available for Joe Public to buy. I trust no one needs to be told not to eat any of these materials or not to put their hands directly in front of a lit butane torch?
 

DX-SFX

Alphans
I use a silver solder it is much stronger. Also I use a water base flux - it is a lot cleaner granted a higher temp is needed but the outcome is well worth it

Part of the problem with that, and I speak from experience, is that in Eagle terms, the temperatures needed to silver solder both anneals (softens) the brass quite considerably and makes the brass expand so that on cooling it distorts. I mentioned in my previous post that I built a silver soldered Eagle frame and it was a b*st*rd from start to finish. Never again. The only reason I persevered was I got so far along the road, it made sense to press on, but every single piece needed "adjusting" after it was in place. However, I agree that in non Eagle frame terms, I find the process of silver soldering even easier than soft soldering and as you mention, much stronger, plus also as you say, the flux washes off in water.
 
Last edited:

DX-SFX

Alphans
Most solder always had a mixture of 30/70 or 36/64 of lead and tin. This gave it a lower melting point and made it easier to use. Here in the states, they are getting rid of any lead in solder because the fumes have been known to cause medical troubles of all kinds. This also makes soldering much more difficult because we now have to use hotter irons or hold a flame to it longer, possibly damaging the equipment your trying to build or repair.

There are lead free solders based on 99% tin that have almost identical melting points and characteristics. You should find the modern solder that plumbers use meet this new specification and are readily available in DIY stores .
 

DX-SFX

Alphans
Incidentally, tin lead solders are not being done away with. They're only being phased out of being used in products with a direct contact to food stuffs or other ingestibles, or parts likely to end their days in landfill such as consumer electronics. They are alive and well, and will continue to be available in the model engineering fraternity. They are not a 'banned' material.
 

rockwellcm

Alphans
DIY use only?

Incidentally, tin lead solders are not being done away with. They're only being phased out of being used in products with a direct contact to food stuffs or other ingestibles, or parts likely to end their days in landfill such as consumer electronics. They are alive and well, and will continue to be available in the model engineering fraternity. They are not a 'banned' material.


Restriction on Hazardous Substances (RoHS) Directive

It was a requirment that by 2006,that all electrical solders (which i am involved) were removed,and therefore banned from use,all sales of lead electrical solder is also banned.

I am also but not directly involved with the plumbing trade,and again,lead solder is also banned.

I also know the recent PS3 Failure problems were mainly down to the new lead free solder issues,this was highlighted on Watchdog TV program,but solder was not mentioned,but is widely known in the trade.

My workplace no longer use it or can get hold of it for trade use.

now a quick visit to my local B&Q i noticed that the Draper brand are still selling electrical solder with a lead content,but on the other hand Water & Santon no longer sell it (asi bought what was left from the Glenrothes branch)

so there must be some loophole somewhere
 

DX-SFX

Alphans
The key words in that directive are 'electrical' and 'plumbing'. They're not being made completely unobtainable (yet). They're just not being allowed to be used in commercial product. White metal contains lead and white metal castings can still be made and tin/lead solders can still be used by hobbyists for amateur model engineering purposes. Most of the solder manufacturers are still making it including Frys, Carrs etc. How long that continues, I don't know but for the time being you can still get it.

http://www.chronos.ltd.uk/acatalog/Chronos_Catalogue_Carrs_Solders___Fluxes___etc_268.html

http://www.yorkshiretilingtools.co.uk/Frys_Powerflow_Solder_250g_3mm

http://www.solderconnection.com/prod_category.php?category=Solder+Paint

-------------------------------------

This is all interesting but perhaps worthy of it's own thread rather than going off at a tangent from the subject of this section.
 
Last edited:
DX, a lot of terrific (practical) information and tips on soldering with torches, but do you know of anyone that has tried the resistance soldering tools that MicroMark sells? I just wondered if there would be any advantages to this method, although the price alone is enough to put me off. You'd have to be doing an awful lot of soldering to justify that kind of expense.
B.P.
 
Last edited:

DX-SFX

Alphans
Yes, I have and they're rubbish. Fine for small electronics and circuit board soldering but they don't have anywhere near the heat capacity to heat the joint masses you'll need to heat. Save your money. Buy a £15 refillable butane torch like the one shown.
 
Last edited:

Alpha149

Forum Supporter
Thanks Chris,

You truly are a living, breathing, reference library on all things it seems. I hope you continue to share your wealth of knowledge with this community however abrieviated it may become. You seem to always have that little "trick" that saves me some time, and for that I am grateful.

Cheers to all!

Evan
 

DX-SFX

Alphans
I can recommend this as one of the best and most interesting books on the subject too. Covers soft tin/lead soldering and hard (silver) soldering with brazing alloys.

[ame]http://www.amazon.co.uk/Soldering-Brazing-Workshop-Practice-Tubal/dp/0852428456[/ame]
 

sliuman

Forum Supporter
DX, I don't know how I missed this thread but after reading through it all I have to say thanks yet again for the kind of plain-English, no nonsense tutorial that even a halfwit like me can follow.


You should write books!
 
Top